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Post by one50 on May 28, 2009 23:49:29 GMT 8
Fots2 Very good request. I have a nice surprise for you too. I'll post this one picture for now. I'll have a few more later once I get home. I have a picture of a 503rd man using a Japanese knee mortar. I will post that later. The Japanese knee mortar is not a knee mortar at all. U.S. Troops gave it that name because of the cup towards the bottom of the mortar. It fits nicely on a bent knee, but looks can be deceiving. The Japanese actually called it the Type-89. If you were to fire the Type-89 from your knee, you would have a one way ticket home with a broken leg. Stay tuned. More info to come.
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Post by one50 on May 29, 2009 11:45:12 GMT 8
Some more photos for you. This is a photo of a 503rd man with a captured Japanese knee mortar. Some pages from one of my Japanese Army Manual. If you can read Japanese. Please translate. Also notice nothing in the manual about placing the mortar on the knee. More info to come. How the mortar works.
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Post by fots2 on May 29, 2009 13:06:31 GMT 8
one50, thank-you for the information and photos. That weapon seems to be often mentioned in battle accounts by US troops.
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Post by buster on May 29, 2009 19:32:18 GMT 8
The Japanese instructions reminded me there's an article about mortars on the website. In early combat with the Japanese, the flexibility of the Type 89, and its lethality became evident to all who faced them. Considering that the M2 Mortar's high trajectory was a disadvantage, Staff Sgt. Norman F. Petzelt developed a "knee mortar like 60mm mortar" that could be safely fired at a very low angle. His first designs were developed in Gordonvale in late 1943, and his prototypes were built shortly afterwards when the 503d were training in staging areas of Port Moresby. Pfc Andrew P. Silvas assisted Petzelt in the development. Our efforts to date have failed to uncover any photograph of the Petzelt Mortar, though Peltzelt's original drawings are reproduced at : Essentially, Petzelt modified the base plate with a swing arm leg that could be easily emplaced to steady the mortar and control recoil when engaging targets horizontally. The mortar could not be "drop fired" in the conventional manner, so he designed a trigger activated firing pin mechanism. The barrel would be supported in the hands and aimed directly at target without the necessity of a sight. It was crude, simple and deadly. After successful proof of concept firings, the officers of the 503d quickly saw the advantages of Petzelt's efforts, and they supported the modification of a number of the mortars. One was allocated to each Company. It could be fired in the same manner as the normal M2, so it was not a replacement for the M2, simply an improved version of the tried and true formula. In an effort to see series production of the "Improved Mortar," Petzelt, with the support of the 503d PIR, submitted drawings to the War Department Ordnance Division whilst the 503d was stationed at Camp Cable, south-west of Brisbane in February 1944. In combat use, the Petzelt mortar was very successful. It was used, but not needed at Nadzab and Mindoro. It was needed and used on Noemfoor where, Petzelt writes, the official count of enemy dead was 30. On Corregidor, it was used to good purpose in placing grenades into the mouths of tunnels and holes, without the necessity of approaching them too closely. It was used on the attack upon the Ordnance Machine Shop, though this action was had to be brought to a close by bringing in a 75mm Pack Howitzer, and direct firing it through the Shop's metal windows and doors. Of the body count on Corregidor, Petzelt went on to say, "No one was damn fool enough to go into any cave to count anyone."
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Post by one50 on May 29, 2009 21:29:36 GMT 8
Buster, Now you got me wondering if this is a photo of Staff Sgt. Norman F. Petzelt playing with a Japanese Knee Mortar for some incite into his project. I think this photo was taken late 43 early 44...thats just a guess though. I know a 503rd soldier in Co. E. with Staff Sgt. Norman F. Petzelt. I'll see if he recalls if this is him in the photo or not.
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Post by buster on May 29, 2009 22:01:26 GMT 8
Peltzelt did the "tinkering" of the low-trajectory mortar in Australia, using machine shops there. It was a great idea, but of course ultimately the low-trajectory path was taken by the bazooka and the RPG.
I find it curious that it was considered such a success on Corregidor, yet it doesn't seem to have been caught on any photos there. I mention this again, because if anyone of you spot a photo of a mortar being used at a suspiciously low-angle, then that will most likely be a rare treasure.
One was lost to the Japanese, and never seen again. Now, if I could only get back into the CFI treasure trove...
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Post by one50 on Jun 5, 2009 10:14:30 GMT 8
Another photo for you Fots2. This one will give you a better idea of how the Type-89 worked. Notice the trigger.
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Post by fots2 on Jun 5, 2009 10:29:25 GMT 8
Thank-you for the information one50. If I ever stumble across something that looks like that someday then I'll know what it is.
It is not unusual to find pieces of what appears to be scrap metal when hiking in the less traveled areas of the island.
One of the guys at the hotel says a former resident of the island found a whole box of hand grenades east of Kindley Field years ago. He buried them planning to return later. When he did return he couldn't remember exactly where they are.
Some tunnels have metal scraps. I have no idea what these things were.
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Post by one50 on Jun 5, 2009 10:57:25 GMT 8
One of the guys at the hotel says a former resident of the island found a whole box of hand grenades east of Kindley Field years ago. He buried them planning to return later. When he did return he couldn't remember exactly where they are. A HUGE word of caution. Japanese grenades are very dangerous. The fuse is very sensitive...and they get more sensitive over time. 60 years is ALOT of time. I wouldn't touch a live WWII Japanese grenade if you paid me. Be careful out there please. PS if you find parts you do not know what they are, post some pics, if it's a Japanese small arms part I can help out. I would think you would find maybe some Japanese Rifle dust covers (little curved sheets of metal) and bullet casings. My theory is all the Japanese ammo would be 6.5mm on Corregidor. Maybe you can help me with that theory.
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Post by fots2 on Jun 5, 2009 11:01:59 GMT 8
Good advise. Actually the only thing I would ever take of any explosives I found is photos. As for irregular shaped scrap metal, I'll send photos of that too if I find more. By the way, this bullet was found in Malinta Tunnel. Is there any way to know if it is American or Japanese? The 2" pocket knife is for size reference.
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