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Post by batteryboy on May 29, 2009 8:27:50 GMT 8
Dan, Here is the famous Banzai photo taken at Battery Hearn during the capitualtion of May 1942. Now the subject here is not the 12-inch seacoast gun but the rifle held by the Japanese trooper on the right most part of the picture. I always suspected that this was a Murata Shotgun. I am trying to determine if any of the Murata's were sent overseas and issued to any of the guards or regular Japanese troops. However I can be wrong. After sometime as I was lost in the maze of my "shelf of doom", I found out that the coast artillery guys had with them a number of Springfield .22 sporting rifles that were used for indoor training during the rainy season. I dont know if this guy found one and was already keeping it was a souvenir when this shot was taken. Anyway, here is a closeup shot of the rifle: Or is this a derivative of any of the Meiji or Arisaka rifles. Cheers, Tony p.s.: To Fots, notice one of the trooper on the barrel of Hearn has with him a Japanese Knee Mortar
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Post by fots2 on May 29, 2009 13:09:18 GMT 8
I see that Tony, thanks.
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Post by one50 on May 30, 2009 4:59:24 GMT 8
This photo has come up for much debate in my collecting circle. We have talked about it in the past and I asked a few guys the outcome of the debate and here is what they said.
"there has indeed been much debate about this picture. i think the general thought is that it is perhaps an 1898 Krag carbine, or perhaps a dutch rifle. it does also resemble a springfield M2, but im not sure how an M2 would have been fielded in war as they were match/training rifles. its a shame we dont really know for sure what the rifle is. although it is obvious that it is a captured weapon."
It is obvious it is an captured weapon. Looks like a 1898 Krag carbine, or perhaps a dutch rifle...I don't know what sense that makes for this guy to have those rifles. Looks like a Springfield M2...your "shelf of doom" info may have shed some light on this debate with us Japanese collectors.
It's not Japanese that is for sure. I'm leaning towards your .22 theory.
Everyone else in the photo is carrying a Type-38 rifle.
Dan
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Post by batteryboy on May 30, 2009 7:36:03 GMT 8
Dan,
To muddle the water some more... In 1998 (100 years after the M1898 Krag), Glen Williford's brother in law stumbled upon the remains of a Krag rifle butt. He found this while looking for the BC of Battery Smith but he wandered near Battery Grubbs instead. In 2000, another CDSG buddy found an intact Krag .30-40 round in the island. Just forgot where he found it.
I am not discounting he possibility of the Krag Rifle as there were a lot of them in the Philippines and at one point in time there were some of them stockpiled in Malinta together with olders materiel.
The nearest theory is still the .22 Springfield Rifle that was used by the CA men during those times.
Interesting and thanks for your inputs.
Cheers,
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Post by batteryboy on Jun 5, 2009 23:30:36 GMT 8
Dan, Here is a photo of the M22 Springfield. Would you say that we are nearing the end of the tunnel?
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Post by one50 on Jun 7, 2009 11:29:46 GMT 8
I'm really leaning towards the Springfield M22. If you compare this to a U.S. Springfield Krag Model 1898, .30-40 cal. Carbine, there are 2 major differences. The Krag has a shorter barrel and does not have a pistol grip. Look closely at the photo you will see a pistol grip on this rifle. I took the close up pic you had and the M22 pic you have and put it in Photo shop to compare the 2 next to each other...it's pretty much an exact match. The Krag is not even close. One thing for sure.....it's a Springfield I think it's the M22 for sure...I'll put money on that. Dan
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Post by batteryboy on Jun 7, 2009 12:18:03 GMT 8
Alright! Case closed...
Thanks Dan...
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