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Post by fots2 on Sept 16, 2012 22:56:07 GMT 8
Don't know okla. Could there be something different on the bottom couple rows than what is stacked above them? If some sort of fuse screwed into the nose of the shells, could a dummy plug with a metal loop be inserted in there to help with transportation. See...you are addictive, now you have got me SWAGing all over the place.
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Post by oozlefinch on Sept 17, 2012 13:13:23 GMT 8
A couple thoughts. Maybe the photo wasn't actually taken on Corregidor, but at a bomb storage facility at an airfield. The projectiles(?) don't look like any I've ever seen. If this was a modern camera with an ultra wideangle lens such as a fisheye, it could make the projectiles look curved, but I don't think they had such back then. Fots, et al, does the size of the tunnel match up with the laterals in Malinta? I can't remember. Were 3"/75mm shells shipped/handled/stacked individually, or in crates/boxes/cartons? What I think is they just don't look like artillery shells. They look more like bombs. Well, that's enough thoughts for now.
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Post by Bob Hudson on Sept 17, 2012 14:31:38 GMT 8
Well Gentlemen, I am really a novice at this but I do have an eye for detail. The shells in the tunnel have a slightly curved appearance from front to back like that of a bomb as opposed to an artillery shell whose casings are parallel to each other . I just don't know but they don't appear to be artillery shells, however the rings on the bottom rows are consistent with a lifting plug of an artillery shell.
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Post by sherwino on Sept 17, 2012 14:50:21 GMT 8
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Post by Bob Hudson on Sept 17, 2012 16:42:26 GMT 8
Yes, I saw something similar at a website with the lifting plug. Doesn't the overall appearance of the shells in question seem curved from front to back or am I the only one that sees that? The lighting is not good in the photo but I believe each shell does have a lifting plug which most heavy artillery shells come with. A trained and experienced eye would know for sure. It's the overall curved appearance that confuses me.
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Post by pdh54 on Sept 17, 2012 17:41:27 GMT 8
Correction: The photo of the ammo in the tunnel is from Armyjunk's posting on the CDSG Forum on January 2, 2009, 7:06pm, not Christmas Eve 2008. I had missed the change over to a second positing when I originally looked at the site. It is 23rd in a group of 32 photos belonging to the collection of Bob Zink. It is labeled as Malinta Tunnel. As I don't know who originally labeled it Malinta Tunnel, I can only assume that Armyjunk would not have posted it as such without being sure it was really that spot. Nor would Mr. Finch have it in his collection of Corregidor photos without it being labeled correctly. I have no idea about the thoughts of the LIFE Magazine man who took the actual picture. Maybe he is the original identifier of Malinta Tunnel. So unless Armyjunk gets on here and tells us differently, I will believe it is a photo of ammunition stacked in some part of Malinta Tunnel. Patty
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Post by fots2 on Sept 17, 2012 19:27:29 GMT 8
sherwino, thanks for the link. There is a lot of information there. okla, there is your answer about the “ring” we see on the bottom rows. It is called an “Eyebolt Lifting Plug”. oozlefinch, this photo does look exactly like the interior of a Malinta Tunnel lateral. The LIFE photo is one of a series of photos that definitely were taken on Corregidor so chances are that this photo was taken there too. Fisheye lenses have been used since the 1920s but this photo does not show the amount of distortion that they cause. A 50mm lens is called a “normal” lens as it shows us a view equivalent to what the human eye sees. (A larger mm number is called “telephoto” and a lower mm number is called “wide angle”). The common 28mm lens would be excellent in situations such as confined tunnels. Although it occurs to a much lesser degree than a fisheye, rounding distortion does occur. I expect the professional LIFE photographers would have the best of modern equipment at the time. The only time I have heard bombs mentioned on Corregidor was during the night the Japanese landed in 1942. Lt. Lawrence’s men slid small 25 pound aerial frag bombs down wooden chutes onto the beach below them. I did a search on different types of WWI and later bombs. The tail fins are very obvious and generally large with respect to the rest of the bomb. The long skinny profile we see in the tunnel photo does not fit any bombs that I saw. Would the little piece sticking up near the rear of this ordinance be the grommet protecting the rotating band (as seen in diagrams on sherwino’s web site)? Bombs Bob, if it is not photo distortion then yes, the curved look to the ordinance is difficult to understand to a munitions novice such as myself. Since the Army recorded everything, has anyone ever seen an inventory of what was stored inside Malinta Tunnel at the start of the war? You gents may be correct about this ordinance not being artillery shells but the Army storing any quantity of Air Corps bombs in their limited bomb-proof space makes no sense to me.
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Post by okla on Sept 17, 2012 21:35:07 GMT 8
Hey Bob....I am seeing the "curved" feature of these missiles also. It is slight, but I am covinced that even these ancient, old eyes of mine ain't mis-firing on me. Those shells/bombs/etc, on both sides of the lateral have a slightly curved appearance. Maybe it is from photographic distortion,etc, but curved they are, in my humble. Fots...I am with you on why would the AAC be storing such ordnance on Corregidor unless they planned on doling it out to the few remaining P-40s still remaining over near Cabcaben. This isn't likely since this pic was taken quite some time before we had any inkling that our Air Corps would consist of only a pathetic few flyable aircraft hidden in the jungle over on the tip of Bataan. Another Corregidor riddle for us to ponder. Doncha love it?
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Post by JohnEakin on Sept 18, 2012 5:00:44 GMT 8
google on 155mm howitzer projectile and see if you don't agree that those are some sort of 155mm projectiles. There are a variety of types and some of the photos appear to have the same rounded appearance.
Weren't there several types of 155 guns on Corregidor?
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Post by okla on Sept 18, 2012 6:45:26 GMT 8
Hey John....You have made a true believer out of me. I was leaning heavily toward that stuff being AA ammo. I hereby change my vote. Those projectiles stored away in Malinta's bowels are surely 155mm Ordnance. Nice work, John. Case closed, methinks.
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